"You have to scream so loud or shine so bright that people notice you. And then once you get noticed, you can have the conversations." - Dines  

In this episode, Dines, co-founder of Studio Blup, discusses the evolution of his creative agency from its graffiti-inspired roots to a global brand. He shares insights on maintaining creative integrity while navigating business challenges, including a merger and subsequent buyback. Dines talks about Blup's new direction as a creative company, focusing on product development, brand collaborations, and launching Blup Academy to support emerging talent.

Key takeaways:

• Maintaining a unique creative vision can be challenging when scaling a business, but it's crucial for brand identity.
• Mergers and acquisitions can provide growth opportunities but may compromise creative freedom and brand authenticity.
• Diversifying revenue streams through products and education can help creative businesses maintain independence.
• Investing in emerging talent and giving back to the creative community can be both fulfilling and strategically beneficial.
• Adapting to change while staying true to core values is essential for long-term success in the creative industry.

Daring Creativity. Podcast with Radim Malinic

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 [00:02:10] 

Radim Malinic: Hey Dines, welcome to the show. How are you doing?

Dines: But then my main man, what are you saying, brother? You good?

Radim Malinic: Dude, it's been a while we tried to make this [00:02:20] happen and here you are. And, yeah, it's my pleasure to have you on, man.

Dines: listen man. I see I've been seeing what you've been cooking up a little recently and, yeah, it's a pleasure and honor to be, in your presence, to have a little [00:02:30] chat, see what we can cook up.

Radim Malinic: Excellent stuff. I mean,I think this is the first time actually I'm speaking to you since you've become a father. How has your life changed?

Dines: Ah, crazy, man. 

Radim Malinic: Congratulations, by the [00:02:40] way. And yeah, how's your life? 

Dines: Thank you, I've been texting you saying gimme some tips of how you do it. but yeah, look, it's life changing obviously. for me, it's just unlocked a whole new [00:02:50] purpose, a whole new hunger. I look in Caleb's little eyes and I think, bro, I'm doing this for you.

now everything I'm doing is yeah, for him. It's not for me now. even if I get paid, [00:03:00] it doesn't go on a trip to IB for now. It goes on a, bunch of nappies. So that's the kind of,angle taking it daddyhood. And yeah, like I said, this unlocked a whole new different beast in [00:03:10] me.

Radim Malinic: with your creative time, obviously, before, even when I've had kids, you know, you can do all those amazing long days and you can go to Ibiza, whatever you want. How do you work? How [00:03:20] has your sort of working life changed? 

Dines: Yeah, well,we'll get into a little bit later, but we we're working remotely now, which has helped a lot. so we got rid of our, Soho space, obviously just like [00:03:30] cost and just reinvesting it back into our independent agency. so now I'm a lot at home, two days a week and the rest of it in meetings for all days and just building a network.

So when I'm at [00:03:40] home, it's nice. I'll give the, the missus a bit of a break. and yeah, just having fun, balancing daddy life and crying and actually trying to jump on a zoom [00:03:50] call and be like two minutes late because I've had to do something. So I'm trying to be hands on as much as possible.

but at the same time,know, when the day stops, say Xena goes to bed, [00:04:00] like nine o'clock, I'm up till one, just carrying on working, researching, downloading,information to get ready for the next day. 

So it's nonstop. Anything [00:04:10] that's changes. Yeah. Going out after work and having a few drinks and stuff.

Now I need to be fresh. And actually that's been a lot more productive. Thank goodness.

Radim: I 

Radim Malinic: think you're a brave man [00:04:20] to work from home. I got literally, as soon as we had our first child, I got literally kicked out because I used to work from the bedroom that became Charles bedroom. 

and it was like, just go. And yeah, it was one of the [00:04:30] best things I've ever done because you try to be Hans and you try to be helpful and to be a new parent and I couldn't be a freelancer agency or the best at working from home, regardless, like whatever you do, it's [00:04:40] always it's a massive juggle because you want to do everything well and you end up doing nothing.

at 

all, 

it's just absolute mess. 

Dines: tell you what though, it's actually got me working a lot more smarter [00:04:50] because I was realizing, hang on a minute, I have to actually create this mood board or answer this email within a certain timeframe. And whereas before I would dilly dally on it and try and find other things to do. [00:05:00] Now I've just got like that list of that.

I look at the desk. tick it away. And if I'm finished by likethree, I'm like, okay, cool. This is more time for me. more time, for the family. but [00:05:10] at the same time, like you said, just having that kind of separation to make yourself think it's hard at the moment 

so my time now is now. So thank God you give me nine [00:05:20] o'clock interviews. That's perfect.

Radim Malinic: Oh, I mean,there's a reason for why this is a nine o'clock in the evening, because I can either do a ten o'clock in the morning, which means the kids are school, or nine o'clock in the [00:05:30] evening when they're in bed, 

and this is always like,you know, I've got two of them, and it's touch and go, sometimes I have to wait for likeanother ten minutes because they've still got 

like, 

starting fires [00:05:40] upstairs, 

Dines: even you telling me that it's just mentally writing it down because that's going to be my time soon. And you're like, bro, if you're doing stuff like this, in between this it's inspiring, [00:05:50] man. So you're using your time very wisely to achieve more. So

hats off bro. 

Radim Malinic: He said, something interesting. He said, it's no longer for me. It's for him, right? Did you feel the [00:06:00] shift that as a parent, your work has been different? You know, your mind has been 

different. 

Any 

changes? 

Dines: I've been a bit more ruthless, I think more ruthless with my time. more [00:06:10] ruthless with just how I manage the business. you're looking at more like the price inside of it. every penny now, it's going towards us. Alex, my business partner and our [00:06:20] families, building something special.

So at the end of the day, that's the kind of real life change that's happening in real time. And, time is of an essence. [00:06:30] luckily I'm doing something that I love every day. but at the same time, I'm realizing there are bigger priorities and bigger passions and bigger love in your life.

that, evolved me and matured me as a [00:06:40] person. At the end of the day, listen, if I can do the two at the same time and grow them two together beautifully, 

then I've won. 

Radim Malinic: It's amazing. So let's talk more shop. So obviously you're [00:06:50] quite well known in the industry for who you are and what you've been doing with Blub. But if someone never heard of you, what would you say that you do with Blub? And what's your mission? What's your vision? What's your purpose? [00:07:00] 

How would you describe it with Blub? 

Dines: purpose is to be as big time as you, brother. Always been the inspiration. But listen,from day one, we've known each other since the Southampton days. [00:07:10] And,when I studied there, I did actually kind of look at, legends like yourself, when you were in South Hampton doing all this stuff before I even graduated and,seeing that there is hope in the design [00:07:20] world to actually like. bring your creative flair to the world and still stick to your guns, develop a style and actually just flourish and, help people. Brands and other people around you [00:07:30] grow. so,for me, it's just, the mission was always to inspire. The mission is always to be like, be myself. The mission was always to like,have that positive energy [00:07:40] around and, view the creative industry in a different kind of light, through the only way I know how, which is, design.

And I think that's really. connected me really well. like to think, I'm [00:07:50] an authentic guy. I wear my heart on my sleeve and, I try to always have a smile on my face, because like I said, I'm, I'm blessed and lucky to, wake up every morning and just like jumping on a computer and create something.

And then, [00:08:00] people appreciate it. So yeah, the the mission was always to build a kind of a big studio, but. As time goes on, you realize that business is hard and it's a never ending circle. [00:08:10] You understand like,okay, what's next? What is your next purpose in life using what you got?

 yeah, there's a few things that we're cooking up and,

yeah, we'll come on through that

Radim Malinic: Amazing, right.we have [00:08:20] to talk about a signature style because with Blub, mean if there's anybody I know who's doubled down on who they are, how they are, how they do it. It's been you [00:08:30] guys. I you know, you see serial cats, studio outputs, Vault 49s, like everyone's had their thing and then they petered off to [00:08:40] corporate world and branding and packaging and it's just, I'm exactly the same.

I mean, we had,some sort of, signature style. You know, it sort of changes. I mean,if I was to look back [00:08:50] 15 years or 10 years, like evolved and we had something, but with your stuff, it's like, it's been blunt ever since like day one. You know, like this is quite remarkable because [00:09:00] of course we all do work behind the scenes that, 

sometimes you have to work for money.

sometimes, you know,your soul is not going to pay the mortgage, but. What you guys put out there [00:09:10] consistently, has been blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. 

 quite a useful word for that. 

Blah, blah, blah. did you ever have That thing that's, when you have that sort of second thought, like, [00:09:20] is this working?

Should we change it? Is this right? is this a unique point? Because, when you double down, you lose competition because no one does what I do or what [00:09:30] you do or we do. the same way. So it's just okay, this is only us. So tell me about the journey of the style because I've been always fascinated that 

in a way, like it's,it's always looked [00:09:40] crazy and it's getting even more eccentric and how was the 

style?

How is it working? And yeah, how's it been? 

Dines: Yeah. That's an amazing analysis. and it's nice to hear from a, [00:09:50] someone that's not inside of Blurp and just looking into it. And that from day one, isn't it? So you've seen the evolution of, the quite basic kind of collage style now to to like the more abstract [00:10:00] style. And the thing I've always said do my talks around the world and, do these,interviews is.

You have to scream so loud or shine so bright that people notice you. And then once [00:10:10] you get noticed, you can have the conversations. so for me, I obviously started off as a graffiti artist and, just loving, just painting the abstracts, letters on the [00:10:20] wall, um, on that clean canvas.

and when people walk past it, they're like, well, that's,pretty decent. That's sick. I don't know what it says, but that's decent. And there's always that kind of, destroy the beautiful, look your own [00:10:30] stamp to it. So I think, the style Blup originally from just like the graffiti days, the remix of just image collage, trying to tell a [00:10:40] story within the image, trying to just push the boundaries a little bit each time and evolve it.

And there has been times where I'm thinking, ah, do I mix this up? But every time I do mix it up, I'm [00:10:50] thinking, I'm just doing it. I want to do this and if I'm mixing up I'm doing it because I think people are getting bored of it. There's millions of people that haven't seen it. there's a back catalogue that [00:11:00] people, might look at Studio Bluffs history and then they fall in love with it and that's how you become a fan.

So I think if you're changing it midway, It shows to me that, I'm not confident in [00:11:10] what I'm producing. it's almost like a rebellion thing as well. I think, even going at university, that fire in my belly, when the teachers used to fail me and say this is too weird, this is too abstract, this is [00:11:20] not graphic design. And the fact that I knew it was digital art, but digital art wasn't a thing back in the day. but I knew, I'm using the tools that the graphic [00:11:30] designers are using and remixing it to make it my own signature. Surely that's an art form that I should be celebrated rather than penalized.

So because of that, I just thought, you know what, , I'm just gonna carry [00:11:40] on doing it, get in trouble. If I fail. But I know that, people will be known for something, known for the designs, style, the energy, and then transport that into the blood philosophy. So all my team [00:11:50] now know that we need to create something that stands out.

and then once it stands out, then it's gonna get noticed. And then when you get notice. It equals jobs. So [00:12:00] long way in the way, but that's the kind of core of the 

style.

Radim Malinic: I think I've just finally after all these years drawn a parallel between you said like I used to be a graffiti artist and now this is what [00:12:10] we do because I've never seen your graffiti stuff it's is it the multi layered multi color you know like a big pieces when did you start with graffiti [00:12:20] when did you start and 

actually where did you do it 

because are you from originally from Brentford is that right or 

Dines: yeah, West London. Yeah, Brentford. So,my cousin, he lived in, uh, [00:12:30] Neeson and he was like quite a big graffiti artist in terms of, he just used to do the,the vandalism type of graffiti. And, I remember going around his and he just had this sketchbook and he was just like drawing it, [00:12:40] like these beautiful handwritten,typography but in graffiti style.

And the way it was so smooth and I was like, whoa, this is sick. what the hell? I didn't know this was graffiti, right? [00:12:50] And I realized later on down the line that each graffiti artist, in London has a different hand style. Each crew has the kind of the same look and feel, but a slight different tweaks.

And I [00:13:00] think it was just that association with having a brotherhood and a crew that you can go out and, we call it like bombing walls with your tags was something really appealing. Also, there was something quite [00:13:10] obviously naughty and rebellious about it that you can get caught and you can get fined or put into prison.

And for me, it's just like that adrenaline rush just to get your art out there. and this is before it was [00:13:20] celebrated, in obviously stuff like Brighton and like the big graffiti areas. It was obviously illegal.so to draw my like, link to it, [00:13:30] I never really did the big wall pieces.

It was more like the sketching in the sketchbook of the graffiti. So that means I can be a bit more intricate. I can do a little more sharp edges [00:13:40] and just. create a word at the site was, it was like just dines or like my old tag was rush or oats, whatever. And I created those things. And then when it got to [00:13:50] like spray paint on the wall, I would actually find it was a nice canvas blank wall, like in my alleyway in my home in Brentford, or just like my cousin's house.

And just, we just spray paint. [00:14:00] and then my mate, my other best mate, Alex, not my best partner. It's another Alex. He had this loft conversion and then he just said to his dad, I don't want it painted, [00:14:10] I just want it just raw MDF on the wall and we're just going to graffiti the whole thing.

So he was about 13 years old, 14 years old, up to like16 every Friday just [00:14:20] graffing on this wall to look like just some scribble book. But to us, it was art. To other people it looked like a complete brown mess. But to us, it was just our expression. so yeah, so that's where the kind of just the [00:14:30] link with the digital art, because before I got into trouble or, you know, got arrested, thought let me just turn this talent into 

something that could actually support my future [00:14:40] rather than, squash it. 

Radim Malinic: it's funny because when you think about like things used to be simpler, like we're not, that much older than you and medium of likespraying paint and like [00:14:50] that. this is we used to do. I mean,I was very unsuccessful tag.

We used to call it tagging, right? It's

and I think I was just too chicken. it was quite liberating because you go like,Oh, this is,what I did. I think this is like the [00:15:00] seed of a graphic designer. It was like, Hey, look on that wall, this piece of me, you know, like,and it's just, I think this has been trying to do as opposed to like,no, what is that 

random squiggle?

Dines: Like,did you, what, why, how, you [00:15:10] know,just correct tagging part was the main thing. And even when I was at school, I had this thick, paint pen, like, the nib was literally about, an inch long. It was massive, and then I was just [00:15:20] like, I know I'm probably getting in trouble now, but like,in the cubicle, just do likethis big illustration and it's like a luminous, bright green ink.

And like,no one knew it was [00:15:30] me and there was like, meetings at school saying who's graffiti and it was obviously Niall. It was like, if you just looked at my book you can connect it. But that's again, it was just like, I just saw it as a blank canvas. I didn't see it as [00:15:40] doing anything naughty or bad.

It's just my expression. So now I look at a digital canvas, Instagram, TikToks, Facebooks, and those digital canvases are now [00:15:50] my toilet walls, 

which I now just want to just get, let people see. 

Radim Malinic: So don't tell your clients, you know,see I see 

your cameras as a toilet wall, 

 might be a bit confusing, [00:16:00] so before we started recording, I said that you recently did, a podcast with, for a different show where you talk about your history of how you went through university and through the [00:16:10] ranks and stuff.

And I mean, if anyone wants to listen to it, we can link back to Claire Blythe's show. which it was nice that we can continue on that show. 

so going From where [00:16:20] you are now, if you've been building blub for quite a while, andthe tagging, I would say I'm quite fascinated style graffiti, but to where you are with the 3D kind of [00:16:30] work that you guys do is becoming really known for.

You mentioned it, and I'm going to link up on a previous question, you mentioned that there's a team and it feels sometimes like when you see that kind of [00:16:40] style of work, that's because you don't want one person like they did their own freelancer. They've got their signature style.

How do you find that you push it for a team? And how do you get that sort of [00:16:50] harmony of ideas and talent? Like, dodo you feel like things are growing nicely that you tell people and they move on to it, that they build it 

bigger, or do you have to control it quite a lot?

how does this [00:17:00] work?

Dines: Great question, mate. And it's a hard one because, you know,you don't want to, for example, I've I've got,a 3d guy, Simon is unbelievable and he just reached out on Instagram and said, look, I [00:17:10] would love to collaborate with you guys. So look, we get messages all the time, but this guy just felt the hunger and he reminded me when I was like younger and taking opportunities.

So when he came to [00:17:20] the studio and we stillhave a chinwag now, and we say to each other, he goes, I'm guys, I'm just here to support your vision. Like I'll do my own style, which is very clean and stuff. And you do your thing, I'll [00:17:30] just turn your idea into a 3D element. I can just make it, look the way you want to do it. I'll add my spin to it, but ultimately I've come to Blup to learn and [00:17:40] collaborate with you. And to hear that from creative that's a lot obviously younger. And, almost like the whole what Damien Hirst does, where, you know, it's not just his name, but it's his [00:17:50] principles to his studio.

for someone to help support that vision is amazing. And at the same time with Alex, even when I'm designing, I don't even show him. I'll just release it. And I want him to see it real time [00:18:00] as, the fans or followers would see it. and then he will. Screengrab it and be like, this is sick.

And I'm like, bro, I'm designing it just for you only, man. Like you and me, cause you've [00:18:10] been from the bottom. And if it hits you and makes you feel good, then I know I've done something right. So when I'm with our team now, obviously, we've got to cater for the clients and we've got a lot of [00:18:20] stuff that's, you know,unreleased stuff.

And like you said, it's, you know, stuff that's paying for, to keep the lights on, uh, it's doing the campaigns, it's collaborating. It's, doing quite minimal stuff. Yeah. [00:18:30] But if I was to release that, people will be like, ah, you're just a standard agency. You know,we've seen this type of work before, but this is what clients want.

and then the stuff that you're seeing outside of the client [00:18:40] side is our time to, as R& D. So if we're then doing client work, we'll take a week off and we say, you know what,let's cook something up. Let's either create our own [00:18:50] merch, let's create our own animation. Let's do something with sound design, music, whatever.

 But we've got time to invest back into the studio and collaborate as a team. And [00:19:00] that often then leads to more work that looks like the stuff that we've been doing. And then that's how you climb the ladder to eventually the brands just wanna collaborate with you because of, what you can produce.

and they [00:19:10] know that it can connect to the audience that you appeal to. so it's a long way round.could you put an amount of money that we could have if we just did the standard 3D stuff. [00:19:20] We're reinvesting our time back in the studio to create legacy and create work that lasts, that will stand the test of time.

And that's what Blurp is about. It's about creating legacy rather than just creating a [00:19:30] norm.

Radim Malinic: brilliant answer, I wanted to know just but for people who don't know, who's 

Alex? 

Dines: I don't know, I don't know, Who is

Alex? 

Nah, he's my friend, [00:19:40] co founder, business partner at the studio, Blurp. we studied graphic design at Solent together and. We were just like kind of inseparable anyway. and what I liked about Alex is when you meet [00:19:50] him, he's like just a cool, chill, laid back guy.

And in a world of Diane's chaos, need a conduit that actually just makes me calm down and says, it's going to be all right, Diane's, we'll sort this out, or [00:20:00] I'll sort it out. And this guy is, you come from a design background, but his whole thing is more about Organization. So I called him the in Integrator and I'm the [00:20:10] visionary.

And after reading Rocket Fuel, were just like, okay, shit, you are now the integrator. I am the visionary. And when we first started Studio Prep, I started it from the second year [00:20:20] and he, obviously then, Did a thesis on me as a guy who's just finished university, launched a company and now he's working with like international brands.

He got a distinction. [00:20:30] and I was like, well, you've got a distinction all right about me. So I said, look, bro, I need you to be like my 50 50. I need you to be almost like a manager. I need you to wake me up in the mornings, get into meetings. [00:20:40] You know what I mean? Let's have some fun. Let's travel around the world and let's do what we love.

and yeah, 15 years later, bro, like we're still going strong. We had one argument. Off he 

goes. about buying a [00:20:50] 4k camera rather than a HD camera. 

but that other than that, we're just on the same path and, yeah, he's the integrator he's the engine to the

blup, 

Radim Malinic: if

only every [00:21:00] argument in the world would be about which camera to buy, I think the world would be a different place. Yeah, that, that is pretty awesome. Like to say for 15 years, I was in bands with people for 

15 minutes and I was like, 

yeah, it's time to [00:21:10] go.

I can't do

this. 

Dines: yeah, yeah, But you know what partnership is all about, as we said, that he is like a marriage classic quote, but,you got to work on it. You got to spend time with each other. You got to [00:21:20] go for dinner and like beers and just talk about anything other than work. And luckily, we've got a crew of boys, are our best friends as well.

we talk about other things other than work. And what the [00:21:30] beauty of it is think when I'm with him, it reminds us of when we were younger. Yeah. And the fun times we had at university. So whenever we just jam and just come up with [00:21:40] ideas, I finally got a guy that's not telling me, no, he's actually saying Dines is sick.

I can make it happen. or let's build on this 

idea. Cause you're onto something here. And that gives me so much confidence just to be like, [00:21:50] whoa, No one's fighting against me. Someone's 

just actually agreeing and actually wanting to build on it. 

Radim Malinic: John Hengelthy said once that every John needs a Paul, you know, [00:22:00] like

Paul McCartney and John Lennon, right? so what's interesting that you said actually that 

you like that Alex agrees with you.

he doesn't seem like he doesn't say no too much. Is that, [00:22:10] do you find thathelpful? Because I mean,want the yes men to surround us because we want it sometimes quite easy, but I feel like creative conflict is where actual magic happens 

because you have [00:22:20] to compromise.

How do you find it? 

Dines: when I say agree, I know what he likes. So I'm actually working towards the stuff that he's got to say yes to. and almost [00:22:30] I have to convince him that my idea is good and if I can't articulate or I can't show why it's going to work, then I know he's going to say no. And there's been plenty of times he's like,Dimes, what are you [00:22:40] doing?

I pitch him to an idea, it has to be fully fleshed out. It has to be straight to the point because he ain't got time to listen to The idea has to be sharp and I have to say why it's going [00:22:50] to work. 

And because I've had weeks of just thinking about it before I announce it, he's like,yeah, this sounds sick.

Because I've got him excited about something that potentially could work. I'm very, [00:23:00] protective over my ideas. I don't put stuff out in the world unless I really thought about it. And I really know there's a niche or a gap in the market because I don't wanna be that guy that just launches [00:23:10] something and doesn't work.

It has 

to be worked and calculated, and I've got him to make it happen.

Radim Malinic: where am I talking about the marriage? like, he validates your ideas and says loads of things that he thinks they're not right. when I'm working on [00:23:20] something my wife says, Oh, what's that? You're like, Oh, that's something really good, right? 

You're working on 

something that's gonna, it's gonna cook well.

so that's interesting. so here's your filter. It [00:23:30] literally, feed the ideas and if he's excited, if it makes sense to him, then you send it out. Because I used to entertain the concept of. to right wrongs, when something feels wrong, [00:23:40] but it feels also quite right. They just, it's just like, you how do you put that thing out there?and you say, obviously like you don't necessarily release anything unless it's fully fleshed out. And this makes sense. It just needs to [00:23:50] appeal to Alex. 

it sometimes stop you? Do you sometimes wish that you put something out there really quickly and be like, you know 

what? I had an idea in the morning.

It's going out. I don't care what Alex thinks, you know,how's your [00:24:00] process? 

Dines: that's when I stopped innovating because I was then doing something that I wasn't 100 percent right and I was just doing it to get a rebel. And when the business kind of [00:24:10] grew and, you know, I was kind oflosing my kind of creative freedom and I didn't have Alex to kind ofbounce off ideas because he was too busy trying to likework out spreadsheets for the next 20 years, [00:24:20] whatever.

And all of a sudden I was like on my own. I was like, Whoa, okay. So then I knew that was the secret formula that I didn't want to ruin. so then I started to, just evolving in other ways and find [00:24:30] out ways of, how I can utilize, the brand and look at brand rather than design. we've got the cakes already made.

It's where now you put these cupcakes, right. Andwhere you put this [00:24:40] brand out. So then that's when I started evolving into like the public speaking, the podcast, the other areas, you know, going to universities and doing the personal workshops, and looking at other areas [00:24:50] where I can still be myself.

But have that core of design. but then at the same time, it evolved me and made me force myself into other situations and other areas of [00:25:00] my life and business because I didn't have that crux. I didn't have that person to navigate ideas with. So what can I do on my own? My own personal brand.

and that's when that, kind [00:25:10] of era kind of grew. 

Radim Malinic: It's interesting. You mentioned something that 

a lot of people mentioned on this podcast before. It's the bigger you grow, we feel like we [00:25:20] lose the creative input. Obviously, we still need the companies. I mean, Igrew up in my studio and I was looking at people doing the stuff that I used to do for fun.

Obviously, I used to be the [00:25:30] driving force, but now obviously I was. turning the wheel. People obviously always collaborating and it's, I think it's that sort of creative dissonance because we sometimes crave the freedom of, [00:25:40] I don't necessarily want to do every single aspect of this work. I want to collaborate.

I want to pay my way forward. I want to give new talent opportunities. But the more senior you [00:25:50] grow, then you kind of feel like losing that touch. You're still in charge of the company, you can still decide like which way the project goes and how do you deal with clients and all that [00:26:00] stuff. If you grow in a studio, why did you feel that happened?

Because did you feel like you have to take on work that wasn't necessarily, it was just work for money and keeping people's pensions paid? Did you feel [00:26:10] like that was the case or why does it happen? I think, and this is more like an open question. Like, why do you think it happens that when we grow bigger and more senior in our roles, why do we feel [00:26:20] we lose the control?

Because. Why do we grow this thing in the first place? Because it's a dissonance. Like I'm working 18 hours a day. I want to work six hours 

more people. I want to grow up. What is your view on [00:26:30] this one?

Dines: That's a really good point, my man. And 

 I think it all stemmed from when I started hiring people to do the roles that I couldn't be bothered to [00:26:40] do. so for example,we had someone in marketing. I was like, I am the marketing. I come up with the ideas, but I thought, let me just pay someone to, do it and come up with some,innative [00:26:50] ideas, hopefully.

you then build out a kind of senior designer that has their own philosophy, but doesn't really connect with what the Blup ethos is. So things like that doesn't work [00:27:00] out. you also have, uh, when we got acquired, you know, and joined a bigger group, then you had people to answer to.

And then all of a sudden, they're knocking on the door and saying, you need to say [00:27:10] yes to this. 50 grand project because, the people at the top aren't going to get paid. And then all of a sudden you just think, am I just like this people [00:27:20] thing, or am I running a,an innovation company?

And when you start losing that magic and you feel like all the work that you're doing, is going down and you're just doing [00:27:30] stuff that other brands want you to do because you know the creative director of so and so brand wants to put his stamp on it and wants to make it feel like his and then all of a sudden we're just a production agency and just doing [00:27:40] his idea then it waters down what you are about and for us money was really good but after a while it's like i [00:27:50] am creativity i am what i amWhat I've been bored to do, and if I'm every day just coming in and managing people, and managing clients and just this hamster [00:28:00] wheel of just brands saying no and fighting against it, it's just like. What am I then? What have I become? so I just lost a bit of the happiness. and then it was to the [00:28:10] point where I was just like, you know what, do I really need to run this agency or can I just do this on my own? I just actually just become a digital artist and artists and just be happy and be broke.

You know [00:28:20] what I mean? And that's when that kind of balance was again, bringing back Alex, where he 

looked at my eyes and looked in his eyes and I said, is this what we're going [00:28:30] to

Radim Malinic: So let me rewind it back because I know a little bit of the backstory. Obviously you mentioned a merger and working for a bigger group. So for people who don't know the things on the inside, what was [00:28:40] the motivation of actually joining a bigger group? Because I guess from one understanding, like when everyone sells a part of the company or sells the company, let's be honest, it's never [00:28:50] really good news, unless you go public or whatever, unless you put shares out. you compromise and maybe your ink with the ink on the paper of your signature. Like, I think,did it ever [00:29:00] feel like you guys could get a free rein and doing things that would be exciting and you feel like it was supporting because it sounds like you actually became more of a production agency for some part of a [00:29:10] bigger group.

you were going to grow Blubb or did you feel like you needed to become part of that group just for safety, for survival? Because I think [00:29:20] you told me before that you guys merged just before COVID or was it before COVID or during COVID?

So did you feel that where you ended up, [00:29:30] did you have any inkling in the beginning that's actually what's going to happen? Or did you feel it was going to be sunshine and ice 

creams 

and, Blubb forever? 

Dines: we knew what it was getting ourselves [00:29:40] into. throughout the years, we've had offers to buy us out, to merge, to acquire the brands, to bring us in in house agencies. Like,we even had a one [00:29:50] for quite a big sports company to say, you know,we want to offer you this amount of money to turn up all our brands around and make it.

give it a blubber fire, give it that edge, give it that cultural [00:30:00] relevancy. this is what we're going to put on a table. And then, you're about to sign this deal and then you read the contract and it's then it's an earn out over five years. And then you think, do I really want to be [00:30:10] earning out for five years and just being potentially being sackable if I don't, if I'm not delivering and you've sold your company for nothing.

And, 

so many horror stories, right? And that kind of gave us a bit [00:30:20] of thicker skin to say that if the right offer came and at the right time, that we would know exactly what we're looking for. we're not young kids anymore, and blinded by, the couple of meals, you [00:30:30] could spend a million a year, you know what I mean?

It's nothing, and you're back to one. So for us, someone came along, And what's the right fit culturally, where we want to take [00:30:40] it and with the ambition, and let us be who we want it to be. Then eventually we will look at it and consider it. Then COVID One of my boys, Ryan, who lives in, China said, [00:30:50] this stuff is real, bro.

if I was you, like this company is going down left, right and center, and you need to future proof your future. Because if you don't, you're going to lose everything. [00:31:00] I was like, whoa. And this was in September.so we got approached by one of our mentors and, basically he just said, guys, I love what you do.

I'm [00:31:10] looking to create a super group, with, tech team, our new linguistic programming team, our comms agencies. And we need a,beautiful,shining little light of [00:31:20] studio blop in our agency to make all the work look amazing. It was like, well, this is good. and cause we trust him as our mentor.

We're like, this is an honor kind of thing. So we negotiated, prices and [00:31:30] there's a lot of stuff in the contract where, we were still 100 percent owners of our brand, there's got to be a buyback clause. there's all little things that could protect us in the long way, right?

at the end of the [00:31:40] day is, and we wanted shares in the group as well. So we're working for something. If we sell the group, then, me and Alex are benefiting. This is life changing,money. and at the same time, it could [00:31:50] be a chance to go as big as possible, and still keep that philosophy and, have hundreds of people working for us and open offices all around the world, all that usual stuff that you think, Oh my God, this is what's going to [00:32:00] happen.

And then after a while, the first year was amazing, you know, to energize, our team grew to, I think it was like 18 at one time. Oh my God, this is like,crazy. we've got [00:32:10] HR for free. we've got like people at the top, CFOs. this is amazing.

We, the group was like 300 people and this is crazy. Our Christmas parties were mad. I was like, this is the place to [00:32:20] be. Then we were promised like, that we could sell, the group in four years time and someone's going to come in, buy the group in four years time. Your eBitDAO will be four times multiple of what you are now.

[00:32:30] And then you can walk away in the sunset buzzing. The deal came after two years and someone came knocking and said, we want to buy the whole group. And me and I were like,whoa, guys, you promised us [00:32:40] to four years. It's a grow bl to a certain amount, and then if someone comes in, we can speak about it.

They're like, nah, we wanna take the deal. So we would've lost [00:32:50] half the company, full studio bl because we would've had to sell the other half. Then we would've then cashed out on the percentage that we owned at, at the group. And then we would've just been working with, for someone in [00:33:00] for.

five years as golden handcuffs and buying us outside and it was like that don't make sense. the same time, it was the breakneck speeds of getting work [00:33:10] done and getting so much in just to cover, like you said, the pensions, the wages, the rent, the 150 grand, just Soho studio rent, like it was crazy, bro.

and [00:33:20] you can imagine like trying to pitch ideas to brands them saying yes, but the next minute. Big chunk of money has gone on just nothing. And then you're,then continuously chasing [00:33:30] this brand. It's continued chasing the work and it's just never ending. And you're thinking,I can't do this.

And I'm looking at my creative team and I'm thinking you're doing architecture floor plans. [00:33:40] You're doing some sort of logo for some accountants. You're not, you'll come to studio, but to be inspired. Yeah, you're doing this stuff just to make, our targets, hit our targets. And I said, [00:33:50] this is not what I need, this is not what I want.

and then, yeah, so people was going to buy us, Pulled out at Christmas, last year. me and Niall looked at each other and we had a [00:34:00] little bit of a smile. And we thought, okay, this is our chance to get out.

Radim Malinic: it's an interesting story to think about, like how we spent about 10 minutes talking about [00:34:10] creativity and the last 20 minutes talking about basically business, like how it's beautifully naive when you start being a graphic designer and graffiti artist, illustrator, right?

[00:34:20] This is kind of like a honeymoon period because you just, don't necessarily need to think about it. And when I was researching for the book, for the creativity for sales, like has anyone actually [00:34:30] started with a business plan? Because. You just want to do the thing that you love, right?

You just want to be like, Hey, this is like my hobby. And I'm getting paid to do my hobby, even though still haven't worked out how to get my [00:34:40] invoice, template done or whatever. And 

people say, 

I've seen, people sending like a JPEG invoice, which was like 17 Meg, like 15 years ago.

You're like, what are you doing? 

Just, you know, [00:34:50] it's just like,you just see the sort of mechanics of business because you make some of these most amazing mistakes, like how things shouldn't be done because. The medium of creativity is such a [00:35:00] fuel for what we want to do, that when it comes to business, sometimes we feel like, Oh, you know what?

It's actually fun to plead the ignorance, but everything that you do from the [00:35:10] business perspective is actually your education because you deal with other companies because you actually need other companies to, give you almost like a way in, less to look out like, Hey, this is [00:35:20] how the real world works, And this is what you need to do to actually understand it. Because. The amount of like new brand strategies that has come out to the internet, or like what we're doing [00:35:30] strategy and stuff, just because we're waking up to the fact that, you know what, there's a real business with people who talking like a real jargon speak with 

three letter abbreviations, you need to [00:35:40] understand this before you even get creative.

And I think that's just the most helpful wake up call for most of the creatives now,you can't just. Be ignorant and say, you know, I didn't [00:35:50] understand this. you know, just part of business or whatever. Like,can't do this. So the question to you is how quickly things became real?

Because obviously [00:36:00] talking about EBITDA and that kind of stuff. not many designers know what EBITDA means. Obviously we've got this deal, obviously you're working for companies, which clearly, obviously, some of it pays the bank, obviously [00:36:10] there's, we've had a fair share of projects that, sometimes, we have to do, and I spoke with James Martin, made by James, another Sam Hamptonian, and it was like, we were talking about the fact [00:36:20] that everyone needs a kebab shop menu in their, you know,portfolio in the first five years.

But things change. Yeah. Was that a loss of innocence? Because it sounds like it was a loss of innocence. It's just like,it was [00:36:30] blubblub. Oh, merger, where's blub? there's just a regular work. And part of me was to say, you know,I'm taking off my hat, which I'm not wearing, to say, no, I'm taking my [00:36:40] hat off to you by sticking to your gowns because you want it to be blub, by all means, because what you could have really done, you can actually stag with the machine, have your people doing the boring stuff.

You can just [00:36:50] You can look at your watch, do your stuff at home, and you know, in five years, it'll be all paid for. 

So,let's go back to the sort of beginning and the loss of innocence. 

sounds like,was it disheartening? [00:37:00] 

Dines: Yeah. Cause if you go, more than anyone, why you'd be built up,your brand's name and it represents you, bro. When people look in the mirror, it's like you're black or like you're [00:37:10] brand new. so for me, I couldn't attach work that represent me. I remember like our website, we had to change the language on it.

And it [00:37:20] was just so agency, man. I was just like, what the hell was going on? But we had to, because then, we weren't sellable. We weren't buyable, so buyable from company. they need to land on our website and know [00:37:30] what exactly you do, the intricate detail, the missions, all that rubbish.

I was like, Oh my God. So then I remember before we, And by the way, I'm not even saying enough, you this could put [00:37:40] a lot of people off by, thinking about selling the company, but at the day, we were free to do what we want. The mission was, get what you can, do Blup is and amplify it, make it bigger.[00:37:50] 

But little do we know, it's just what Blup has is so unique, it's so niche. You can't amplify it, because you amplify it, it loses, like you said, the innocence of what it is about. The [00:38:00] purity of what creativity is about. And it goes back to the graffiti days. It goes back to just inspiring people.

And Thank God that was always the [00:38:10] core for Alice and I, and we knew something wasn't correct, and look, if the band was under a different name, and I still have Blup and that running on the side, and then [00:38:20] me and Al launch Pulb, like in production studio, we were like, ah yeah, to hire a team, do whatever you want, no one's gonna know that we've done it, we can just run this thing over here.

But because it was Studio Blup Ltd, it [00:38:30] reflected on us. And I think, what that taught us is, like you said, about the three letter business words and stuff like that. It evolved me again. And I [00:38:40] actually probably was looking for something to mature me in terms of business.

If I want to talk to a businessman, I need to articulate my words as sharp as possible. and knowing that I ain't no [00:38:50] fool, I'm not, that's that creative guy. So I'll be going into meetings and I'll be taking over the room and saying guys, even your group's website is awful.

Let's talk about what we can do. And then everyone was like,dying, [00:39:00] dying, dying, dying, dying, dying, dying. It's like,what idea have you got? And I felt good. And I felt, appreciated and I thought, I was like, I've earned my place on this table full of people who are more experienced, [00:39:10] more older, and they were listening to me rant for five minutes about some design philosophy and I would feel inspired.

So for me, I was just like, wow, like it just proves that [00:39:20] what creativity is,is so rare that people who haven't got it, doesn't matter what background you are, they will listen to you. And I felt welcomed in that group. Honored and [00:39:30] needed in that group. but unfortunately it was just too much of a bigger step to if I said to someone, could you help me?

can Blup do to, get an extra hundred K a [00:39:40] month? And I'd be like, well, we don't know, but you're an expert in your field. Yeah. But in corporate world, we are not in your world. And then we're just like answering our own questions. And then me and I [00:39:50] had to find ways of still keeping the brand as well as making that money.

so to answer your question, it was just, Yeah. Overall, just keeping [00:40:00] it true to yourself, but at the same time, knowing that you have to sacrifice a little bit of your creative flare just to fill those invoices, basically

Radim Malinic: Speaking [00:40:10] of going forward, it's an interesting story. yeah, I'm just trying to get my head around it. Like how,

the more people you involve the process, The more [00:40:20] noise you get to, to enjoy andand not enjoy because there's a shift. remember following, our contemporaries like Vault 40 [00:40:30] nines and the kind of stuff, and you go like style, amazing style.

And they like all of a sudden what happened? 

Or more employees, bigger clients and I had. That vision of I'm [00:40:40] not going to budge. I'm not going to change. this is what I'm going to do. But then I felt like I found like a natural ending to it. Cause I was just like, okay, I found a back of Photoshop with the style that I was doing.

let's bring other [00:40:50] people in and see what's there. It's open. And I kind of,in my opinion, actually opened a lot of new horizon opportunities, and I realized that. I was okay doing things [00:41:00] and I felt stronger with the people that were surrounding us to help us. And I had some sort of amazing creative partnerships with quite a few people that, you realize you can turbo your process.

Like all of a sudden, like you can [00:41:10] be chasing your business or being on a call with a client and the work's getting done by, you know,

and gets,coded and stuff. So I found having Timurami always liberating that, things move a lot 

[00:41:20] faster. 

 And I think it took us like, 18 months to catch up with my to do list.

I'm like, Oh, a team of people. And we are still catching up. We're still getting the work done. [00:41:30] And I think I had that sort of natural break point when I realized thatthere's a trade off between the work, ego, freedom, children, 

time, [00:41:40] writing books and stuff. So I just realized that there's only one way you can push. The soul through one, channel and the other ones just, we have to give [00:41:50] way. there's experiences there, we can be branding a building, of course we'll be doing, the brochure and the floor plans and the, you the 3D and stuff. So sometimes it's just accepted that, you[00:42:00] know, well, that's what it is, it pays for this house, it pays for the studio, it pays for the staff, so sometimes it does miss us that bit.

and that. I don't think I would necessarily be, like, just like in your case, be [00:42:10] dealing with a situation where you go, Yeah, give me ten more people to be telling me what I should be doing because I think that be quite challenging. So let me go to the future. Let me go to [00:42:20] where you guys heading.

So I hear that Blb is now creative company. It's not,creative agency, it's a company. So I wanna know what inspires you? 'cause you said, you know,you're staying up till one o'clock, two [00:42:30] o'clock in the morning, downloading, sort oflooking at stuff. So what inspires 

you and 

where you going with this? 

Dines: Yeah. So we brought ourselves back on the 21st of December, [00:42:40] 2023. And we said, we're now going to be Blup 3. 0. We're going to go back old school. We're going to [00:42:50] create. Unbelievable, inspiring work, we're going to collaborate, we're going to tour the world doing our thing.

we're going to relaunch our products. we're going to do more brand [00:43:00] collaborations and just do us. All right. we've had to trim, overheads as well. So we're a lot more leaner. Like I said,we've got rid of our space to work [00:43:10] remote because now we're working with international, creators.

and we have a lot more freedom that we can invest the money back into our company. With that, it's this kind of, we're [00:43:20] launching multi brand stuff. So we launched our Blup Academy, which is going to be our,biggest thing that we've done. And instead of pitching again to [00:43:30] do work against our agencies, how do we create a revenue stream that.

You're selling your ideas, and you've developed a, something [00:43:40] that, academic students need when they graduate, because a lot of these kids are lost. So I was born with, Blup Academy, where we're going to do like online courses, online, downloads, we're just going to [00:43:50] basically just, Make sure the next generation of creators are in good hands and partner of the universities to launch that and that's going to be our number one thing and that's our purpose.

I've been speaking at university 15 years. [00:44:00] and, it's finally, there's a chance where I can input our ideas and our philosophies into these kids that when they graduate, they're going to have fun and then [00:44:10] launching, obviously the blup merchandise as well. We've seen brands smashing it, and it's like, why can't we do it?

we're designing content for other brands and making other brands rich, why don't we actually just come up with our own, [00:44:20] sunglasses, our own t shirts, our own candle that smells like a studio blup, and promote it the way we want to promote it, and make our own money through our own brand.

we are a brand now, and we [00:44:30] have an audience that brands want to connect to. So we have to understand now, the time that we've got, We want to invest into Studio Blup, and at the same time, if brands want to [00:44:40] collaborate with us, and create amazing work, the door is open, but we can actually approach on our terms, not necessarily pitch, against our agencies and get paid two [00:44:50] grand to pitch, and then they steal our ideas.

Dines: No, no, no. If you want to work with us, you know what we do, you know what the history is, come knock on our door and let's work together long term and create partnerships. So with that new [00:45:00] energy, And that new vibe of where Blup is going to go. I just wake up every day knowing I'm just so excited. 

Radim Malinic: just wanna know what candle smells like? [00:45:10] Studio bl. 

What is it? 

is it, so is there a beak? Street Kebab. So 

Dines: nah, it's just full of, it just smells of pure inspiration. It's full of just joy and happiness. And when [00:45:20] you walk into the room, you just want to desire man. It's our own unique scent. it hasn't been developed yet. But when it does, it's homeware and all that stuff.

But it's The Blup logo, man. I want to buy that I want to [00:45:30] give out my people. and it's really investing the money and stuff that we want to have fun with.

Radim Malinic: are you building a product line just with purely with profits, no, no external investment, it's just [00:45:40] pure 

sort of reinvesting money into, 

Dines: Yeah. So luckily Alice 

is balancing the books and just saying, all right, we've got this amount of money. Basically it's our marketing, if you think about it. So people are gonna be like, what is [00:45:50] Blup? And then Google it. And then they see our history and they see what we've done and they become a fan of the brand and it just helps us build authenticity.

It builds us, build a community and then we can use that [00:46:00] community to actually just. create bigger and better stuff. most people spend their money on,Facebook advertising and it's just nah, innovate, man. if you can innovate and have fun with it [00:46:10] and good, you and me, bro, you will,you are doing it now with your book and your t shirts back in the day, your brochures, like it's products, man.

but you have to have the respect. Of your [00:46:20] clientele to sell the product. You can't just be a standard design agency and release a t shirt. No one's going to buy it. If you're just looking at the website and it's uninspiring, 

got like your t shirts, I still wear it. I wore it the other day, [00:46:30] bro.

It was a sick fit. I wear it because it represents you, bro. And I'm a fan of your work and that's how people wear our shit.

Radim Malinic: think there's something magical about putting money, back into [00:46:40] circulation and just So spending on, on, on commitment, because what I've done for the last 18 months, I haven't taken a new client commission, which is working with existing clients [00:46:50] and everything that we've earned, any surplus goes into commissioning things.

building DTC brands, which the books have been there,there's many things happening behind the scenes, [00:47:00] which you kind of, I think there's a break point. And I think someone might need to hear this because when you're a freelancer, when you're starting out. You're so cautious about like,am I [00:47:10] earning, you know,is this going to be okay?

Because it just feels like a really scary fricking lion's den. You know, like,Hey, nothing's guaranteed because we see at the [00:47:20] beginning of our. Creative careers, everything sort oftransactional, like we don't think I'm going to work with this client for the next 10 years. It might happen by accident, but we don't necessarily see it that way.

we don't [00:47:30] always sort see the clients, like Amazon sees customers, you know,let's get them to buy paperback at a loss, we lose money on the paperback, but we get them through the [00:47:40] door and build it because I can see so many fights of people going like,Hey, they haven't paid us enough money.

We're not going to do the work. I'm like, How much you've got, we can make it work, because you get [00:47:50] to that cost because people grow them because we get them to leg up and It can feel quite scary. I'm like, Hey, what have you done? I've invested everything back. I've also bought a house.[00:48:00] 

I don't know how, it's just like we just moved and all of it that we've done all this. We've published two books at the same time. It feels scary, but it's necessary because you might [00:48:10] have seen in my post like it's no risk, no story and I think that sounds exactly what you 

guys 

doing. You know,it's no risk, no story. 

Dines: hats off to you, man. And, even just writing a book, [00:48:20] bro, like that's, it's crazy. And,you know, that's a different part of your brain that you're tapping into and you're creating that products, but that book is going to be there for the next thousand years, you know,buried in the [00:48:30] sand.

People dig it with a beautiful orange front cover. I've got your whole series. But the thing is, a different shift in your mind and you're focusing on. [00:48:40] Okay, how do I market my own products? how do I make sure this product is so good that you improve every time, like your books have, our qualities of our t shirts have, and just making sure [00:48:50] that when someone rocks your stuff, they're like, man, this is sick.

I remember, velvet case, your velvet, feeling, book cover. I'll never forget that because that's the first time [00:49:00] I thought, because I know you went to the printer, so you knew all of that, the techniques, and I was like, this is the most beautiful. Feeling book I've ever had, and I'm just instantly going to put this on display [00:49:10] and that's when I realized it was about quality and the pride that you had in your products that people want to just put it on display And that was like the basis of just how you know, [00:49:20] you have a good product Just make it look unbelievable feel good smell good and then you're in then you're 

winning. 

Radim Malinic: It's a sensory experience because when you see like 2D [00:49:30] medium, like you can have a 3D work, a 4D work, whatever on your website, but like when you smell it, when you touch it, when you get close to it, this is what I always find like creating my own product.

You always [00:49:40] experience and try to do things that you don't always do with your clients, because I remember like creating a book number three, like 14 years ago [00:49:50] now, living in Chelsea, and it was like, it was plight paper, like it was more expensive per cover than I can print books now with 224 pages.

It was really expensive, 

but [00:50:00] you know what, it's just I always feel They're the little steps. We need to cherish them and see like where we're going with this because no one has a long term plan apart from Craig Black, [00:50:10] which I interviewed a while ago,he's done amazingly knowing where he's going, but all of us are like, we just see 10 meters ahead 

going. I see what I'm doing there, but that matters, because those [00:50:20] steps take you somewhere where you didn't really know where you were going, where you were heading, and you can then enjoy and look back and take the good steps, example, you're looking at buying your merchandise, and I remember one of your t shirts [00:50:30] was worn by Annie Mack, like the full amount of overall prints and stuff, but all of these things, Alex, are such an important stepping stones in understanding where we're going, how we're [00:50:40] doing this, youwhat might happen, because I think it might be quite easy to to realize, you I'm a finished article today.

Radim Malinic: you just keep playing, keep exploring because, you never [00:50:50] know what might happen next and might see where it takes you, because I think being open to these open doors, you know,people come here for the linguistic stuff. it's being open to these opportunities.

It's, this is where you never know [00:51:00] where it might take you. So. taking me back before, before I let you go, I want to know about Blub Academy because you talked about, new talent, new graduates being left in the good [00:51:10] hands. So what would they learn from 

the Academy themselves? 

Dines: So I remember doing a zoom call with university and there [00:51:20] was about 50 kids on the call. When I say kids, young talent, they don't mind me calling kids. They sound old. 

for some reason I looked all their eyes had to have the camera on, which [00:51:30] was quite a weird thing. And they were just like inspired by like our journey.

and what we created. But at the same time, they just felt lost. [00:51:40] And I got like a load of emails before saying, I just don't know what to do because, COVID, we've been locked in. I can't express myself. I'm running out of ideas. I've got creative block [00:51:50] and, I'm too nervous to meet people.

And, now I've seen what you guys do. It's given me hope. And I was like, Whoa, I Okay, so there's talent there [00:52:00] that's not being celebrated or not being supported that when they leave university, they're just left dead and they are just working at [00:52:10] mundane agencies or even not even in creative and we're losing a whole generation of people.

good talent, because they haven't had the support in between. So I kind of [00:52:20] like,work closely with, the, lecturers I know, Riccardo from London Bear is, Derek Yates, Chris Venables all the from Birmingham, all the,the big dogs.

And, I [00:52:30] said, like, what can I do to help? I think I've been coming in and giving talks and, giving out posters and stuff, but it's just in and out,and, like I said, I've been speaking for about 15 years and I've [00:52:40] seen people at now higher positions of brands saying, guys, I remember when you came in and you made me inspired me to get this job and, now we want to commission bluff to work on something.

Now I can, I'm the one that controls the money. I'm like, [00:52:50] Oh, sick. This is great. Again, during the buyout, I was getting told off for going to universities and talking and doing stuff in my own time because [00:53:00] they were like, Dines, like that you're going to universities and inspiring, but let's focus on a business, you you know, we've got targets to reach put your time into that.

I went, nah, I'm doing this after hours. Don't tell me like [00:53:10] what I need to do. I'm going to these six o'clock, nine o'clock seminars and talks. I'm going on my lunch break. So go to these classes and I want to inspire these students. And if that's my true [00:53:20] calling and my true purpose, and I leave this and I can then go on to this, then that's what I'm going to do.

So in the end, I,kind of set out like, that our, I reckon we should, we need to like, create a Blup [00:53:30] Academy, and it's not something to rival the universities, it's something to work alongside them, and we're going to teach the methods the Blup way, that's the difference, not everyone can do it, we're teaching [00:53:40] what we did to get to where we are, and we're going to give like the real life experiences, through mentorships, to online courses, to [00:53:50] live briefs, to doing workshops.

It's a whole new beast. And then eventually we're going to launch our platform at the end of the day to build that kind of database, that they just log in for likea [00:54:00] pound a month or something like that, but you've got resources to download. You've got, interviews, which I'm going to interview you soon, but it's just there, right?

And it's just to give back, to the community. And at [00:54:10] the end of the day,if this then becomes what Blup is really supposed to be, then that's what it's supposed to be. But at the same time, we have to stay relevant, bro. We have to stay relevant. [00:54:20] So the work that we do has to attract the talent.

If we're not attracting the talent, then they're not going to join. So that's the motivation to keep innovating and keep producing amazing [00:54:30] work. So then the kids know how to do it the bluff way. And that's it in a nutshell.

Radim Malinic: that's an amazing point to wrap up on becauseI've known you for God knows how [00:54:40] many years and. I always knew how excited you are about things and obviously like you talking about the merger I think is the flatter I've ever seen you like This is not quite [00:54:50] right And so dude keep doing what you're doing because you know as you say you want to stay relevant You want to attract people you want to help them and I think that's that sort of selfless thing which comes with [00:55:00] our work that The older you get it's less about you It's it's more about them and about what we can do for one another because that's one of the most important things because we've got these [00:55:10] talents and, we put it in a jar and we're like, this is me, don't touch me, you know, like,

what are you, going to end up with?

Dude, pleasure to have you on, pleasure to chat to you. And thanks for sharing, obviously the information about the [00:55:20] more business side of things, because, especially for people who are thinking, what this might be like, for, you know,what does it entail? I think that's very honest.

So I appreciate that, you know, you openingopening up about that and [00:55:30] sharing the detail and, yeah, we'll link up in the show notes for your, academy and for your, you know,what you guys doing. And yeah, 

I'm 

sure I'll speak to you soon. Nice one. 

Dines: brother. And you keep shining [00:55:40] and keep doing your thing. I love you, brother.

Radim Malinic: Nice one. Thank you.

Radim Malinic: Thank you for listening to this [00:55:50] episode of Creativity for Sale podcast. The show was produced and presented by me, Radim Malinic. Editing and audio production was masterfully done by 

Neil mackay,. from 7 million Bikes [00:56:00] Podcasts, 

Theme music was written and produced by Robert Summerfield. If you enjoyed this episode and would like to support the podcast, please subscribe and leave a rating [00:56:10] or review.

To get your own action plan on how to start and grow a life changing creative business. You can get a copy of the Creativity for Sale book via the links in show notes. burning, [00:56:20] and until next time, I'm Radim Malinich, your guide through this exploration of passion, creativity, innovation, and the boundless potential within us [00:56:30] all. [00:56:40]